Oct 21 2007
Dealing with Futility
When I started this I was open to anyone posting and presenting ideas, but I had hoped that civility would be the rule of the day. What kind of world are we in that ideas are such a threat that the only response by some is insults and personal attacks? I have a thick skin, but even I am occasionally disturbed by the depth of the senseless attacks.
I began this with the hope that it would grow into a thriving community where the world would see the northwest as it is, a thriving community with diverse opinions.
The question now is, where do we go now? Shall I let Perri depart when he has been a valued contributer? Do I disallow Dan doe to his constant litany of abuse, or require some measure of self ontrol from him? He also has contributed some thought provoking ideas.
The floor is open. This needs to be resolved now before the site fractures completely.
6 Responses to “Dealing with Futility”
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While I understand, and respect, Perri’s decision, I believe that this site needs to remain a place for all opinions and attitudes.
If we wish to be in an echo chamber, we all have our own sites, where we can keep a tighter reign on postings and comments.
For myself, I respond to posts/comments where I believe there is a resonable chance of a rational disagreement and conversation, which many times does occur. I think it is very important to have voices that do not always resonate with the majority of opinion on the site, and I think it invigorates all of us to have our conceptions questioned.
Having said all that, I would like to have the general tone raised somewhat. I try very hard not to use ad hominem or personal attacks, and to keep the conversation in a friendly agree-to-disagree tone.
Some of my most welcome political discussions are with a friend who is center-left on most things - but at the end of the discussion (loud as they may get), we are still friends.
How boring the world would be if everyone agreed with me, on every issue.
On a a personal note, I realize that my contribution here has been lacking, for a number of personal and work related reasons. I have recommitted to once again becoming part of the conversation. Because, in the end, we are all here to share our knowledge, and learn from each other.
It isn’t Dan’s liberalism that I object to. I agree Karl that he’s made some though provoking posts. It’s his insults to other bloggers and his insults to visitors that I object to. That and the fact that he doesn’t seem to be able any more to get past name-calling for the subjects of his posts.
"the shrub". "the mad king". "fooliani".
I don’t care if he agrees or disagrees with the policies, personalities, or religions of the people he writes his screeds against, but that sort of tone is vile. His blatant and regular use of obscenity also leaves much to be desired. This is the sort of thing that turned me away from some right wing sites like the Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler.
I won’t (and can’t) say that I have been completely blameless. I’ve called him a fool myself, but only after particularly vile remarks that he’s made.
Rather than debase myself further and sink to his level, as I feel will ultimately happen if I continue to argue with him I would leave. Not happily, but there you have it.
Since you can’t delete my account without deleting my posts, I’ll withdraw that request, but I will no longer read or respond to anything that Dan writes.
Your problem is you don’t see how insulting your own positions are, Perri. Some people, some things need to be sworn at. The reason "we" are in this pass nationally is the swearing didn’t start soon enough. Political correctness is a trap.
"The shrub" is accepted nearly everywhere. His administration has easily earned the moniker mad king. And too bad if "Fooliani" is too close to the truth for your comfort. I notice you don’t have any problems with less than nice terms for Democrats…
I don’t post on the other blog because its a huge hassle. I don’t have the kind of access the rest of you do and the two programs are incompatible.
And BTW, deliberately trying to "out" someone who posts under a moniker is dirty. It proves you are just one more dirty sonofabitch with a smile who merits no courtesy.
I have considered giving up on political posts entirely and concentrating on more important things like the environment. I have also considered giving up on this site. Unlike others, I don’t post because I am looking for an audience or pandering to one. If I were doing that I’d post on KOS or HuffPo where I would have a wide audience who wouldn’t even blink at "the shrub."
I really don’t care about reaching an audience. I am the only balance this site has. You and SVC especially are total RW maniacs whose views are not only a danger to the Republic but egocentric to the point that you don’t even know how extreme you are. I am neither liberal nor left. You don’t have a clue what liberal or left is, and you don’t care, which is why your bunch are now a hopefully permanent minority.
Do I get ugly? Damn right. I’m as ugly as you are arrogant. The "right thinking" by the "right wing" and it’s support of its causes is easily the most arrogant thing the monkey man has ever created. You constantly support the unsupportable and refuse to acknowledge the inconsistencies you create and the carnage that results from the same old bullshit you promote.
You don’t like being called names or having your icons insulted.
I don’t like having MY constitution trashed, MY money spent on the terrorists of Tel-Aviv and the disaster of Iraq. I don’t like being endangered by the justifiable backlash of the policies you support and inconvenienced by your fears.
Just as with the moniker issue, it’s your feelings vs my material harm. Everything about the wingers comes down that way, from their prohibitionist approaches to social issues and attempts to institutionalize their filthy god to their foreign adventurism. We get characterized as being unAmerican for criticizing your unAmerican actions…
You label me ugly… Look at what you stand for. That’s the real ugly here. And we’re just supposed to stand by and let you get away with it?
Not me.
Here we are talking about some of the most important issues our nation has ever faced, issues which have our very existance as a nation in the balance and we have to take a break because poor Perri got his fealings hurt. TOO DAMN BAD! Swear words and name-calling mean nothing in comparison to the atrocities being perpetrated by our own terrorist in chief as he brings and end to the greatest experiment of all time. THE AMERICAN EXPERIMENT. How many of our soldiers are we going to allow him to sacrifice for the greed of his friends? How much of our children’s money are we going to let him spend so he can play king of the world? How many Muslims do we allow him to kill for the glory of his Christian God? How many of our constitutional rights do we give him so he can keep us all safely under control? When faced with such fundamental obscenity, why should I give a hoot about the feelings of a neocon apologist?
Maybe because the way we treat each other says somethign about us as a nation.
Maybe because if we cannot debate ideas without resprtong to personal attacks t shows us as not having any actual reason to debate.
Maybe because the loss of personal respect is a sign of a deteriorating society.
But mostly? Because the people here deserve it.
Note that Turtle is Dan’s co author of Road Kill Journals. No bias there.